Tom
Chats A Bit
Posts: 218 
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Post by Tom on Oct 23, 2020 15:05:59 GMT
Hi all, It's been a while since I last posted here (~1 year) amazing how life gets in the way of fun... I have a '91 NA which once upon a time ran beautifully, initially N/A, then turbo, then once more NA... Then I whipped the head off, had the valve seats reground, skimmed 40thou off the head, got some kent cams and fitted ITBs.... This was a year ago, the car has not run consistently or properly since  I have checked the following: Timing- is fine, definitely good enough to start! Continuity and power to the coil, have changed the coil twice... Can hear the fuel pump leaking and see a slight weep around an injector seal (new ones en route) so there is fuel. It has spark, have used a spark tester.. The car has a very early ME221 ECU in it which has a generic NA base map on it. The car very very very occasionally starts and runs, and it will occasionally fire but typically it just cranks and cranks and cranks. This has been going on for a long time now, I've tried on several occasions to get it going and am now essentially at the end of my tether- fix it soon or sell it and buy a hot hatch  Any help would be hugely appreciated as with the ITBs, lumpy cams and 4kg flyin miata flywheel I think this would be an absolutely blast if it actually worked.. Thanks, Tom |
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Post by Zed. on Oct 23, 2020 17:51:39 GMT
is it worth starting at the begining? re-install the basemap? check if there are any 'jumpers' that are in the correct position on the ecu's board? calibrate the tps? (is it wired correctly??) live-data check (with a craptop) the crank/cam position sensor is sending the ecu a signal? are the plugleads on their correct coils? dynamite?  they're a simple engine setup, basic start, run & idle should be easy  earlier 1.6's had an 'ignitor' thinggy (near fusebox on innerwing) that can play up theres probably more do you know anyone locally that has a similar age 1.6 car you could borrow components from (or test yours on their car?) Rich. |
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Tom
Chats A Bit
Posts: 218
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Post by Tom on Oct 24, 2020 11:14:30 GMT
is it worth starting at the begining? re-install the basemap? check if there are any 'jumpers' that are in the correct position on the ecu's board? calibrate the tps? (is it wired correctly??) live-data check (with a craptop) the crank/cam position sensor is sending the ecu a signal? are the plugleads on their correct coils? dynamite? they're a simple engine setup, basic start, run & idle should be easy earlier 1.6's had an 'ignitor' thinggy (near fusebox on innerwing) that can play up theres probably more do you know anyone locally that has a similar age 1.6 car you could borrow components from (or test yours on their car?) Rich. So I have tried reinstalling the base map a few times, and tried a couple of different base maps. Annoyingly I had to un-partition my laptop so I currently do not have a windows machine to plug into the ECU- a few ebay bids and hopefully this will be sorted come the end of the weekend. Jumpers etc. are all identically set up to how it was running perfectly previously, other than changing the basemap from FI to NA I haven't played with the ECU at all. Reassuring that I have similar ideas- Was going to check the CAS signal on laptop once I have the capacity again, though timing was set and CAS seemed to be doing it's job altering that. Leads are definitely correct, have checked this multiple times, and 3 different coils! I have power to the ignitor, and then onwards from the ignitor to the coil so this seems healthy currently. TPS has been calibrated a couple of times now- though I have previously got them running without this! You're right it is a simple engine, my dad and me between us know enough about these things that it's immensely frustrating that this just won't go! That being said primarily it's non-fuel injected knowledge, but the basic principles are the same! I don't have an 1.6 friends I know of locally currently either which is annoying. Cheers for the input though, I think perhaps the next step is to sort a laptop and go all Paul Walker on it... |
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Tom
Chats A Bit
Posts: 218
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Post by Tom on Oct 29, 2020 13:19:15 GMT
Got a laptop up and running today after much swearing at the apparent refusal to install drivers... Anyway it worked. ECU is happy, tried 2 different basemaps, one totally standard NA map and another ITB map. I am not an ECU genius so any recommendations on what to check etc. would be useful. TPS is working, though calibration is slightly out- I do not believe this would stop it running though! CAS seems to work as I get an RPM reading back from the ECU.. Have an accurate IAT reading, MAP seems to be fine... It just cranks and cranks and cranks. Can hear the fuel pump prime when I start it up, have compression tested it, spark tested it and the timing seems to be okay, reading 10 degrees- though this rises to 20 degrees when I sit and crank it  I am genuinely at the point where I want to get some track time in the new year and a supercharged cooper S or similar is becoming more appealing by the second as a winter prep project! I hate giving up though, and the car has some money in the engine that I have never even got to try out! |
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Post by batou on Oct 29, 2020 13:21:52 GMT
Can't really help on ECU recommendations but I will say if you get a Cooper s don't Canoe about with the engine much unless you want another headache...  |
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Post by noobie on Oct 29, 2020 14:01:46 GMT
Have you verified cam timing? If its out a tooth you'll have a hard time starting her.
Same thing for base timing. Check TDC with a screw-driver so you know nothing has shifted.
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Tom
Chats A Bit
Posts: 218
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Post by Tom on Oct 29, 2020 16:29:12 GMT
I've calmed down a bit now  I think I'm going to whip the head off again, the coolant re-route leaks anyway and trying to fix that in situ is horrific. Re-check absolutely everything, set all timing from scratch again and go from there. I did do my research at the time and concluded it was fine, with an aggressive head skim the timing is altered, but not enough to cause it to refuse to start.. |
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Post by Zed. on Oct 29, 2020 16:44:11 GMT
I've calmed down a bit now lol an aggressive head skim the timing is altered, but not enough to cause it to refuse to start.. did you use standard cam pulleys & standard timing marks? should be close enough to start & run but won't be accurately timed for full performance also as suggested by noobie, check tdc before the cams  Rich (I have a few Birch branches ready for my cars  ) |
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Post by dickie on Oct 29, 2020 20:26:44 GMT
Hi.
I have arrived a bit late on this thread,
Have you changed the plugs ??
I went through three sets before I could get my Mongrel running properly. Itbs Cams etc
ME221 base map unsuitable for ITBs. Use the engine parameters from the Mazda and look at the ST 170 map for the set up for mapping.
Look at the mapping table set up. ( 0 to 100 ) The OEM map is set up differently.
Make sure to use TPS MAP not MAP TPS in engine driver.
Modern plugs do not have resistance to fouling like the older plugs.
Chuck another set of new plug into the beast and give it a try.
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Post by dadbif on Oct 29, 2020 22:24:03 GMT
You say you have checked spark, how, plugs out of cylinders so you can see it spark? Should do something with spark and fuel...
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Post by noobie on Oct 30, 2020 8:29:39 GMT
I did do my research at the time and concluded it was fine, with an aggressive head skim the timing is altered, but not enough to cause it to refuse to start.. I'm not thinking about th change due to the skim, just making a simple Canoeup and mounting a cam one tooth off. It sucks, but it happens often |
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Post by warpspeed on Oct 31, 2020 6:54:25 GMT
Start again totally from scratch completely from zero.
Assume absolutely nothing...
Confirm top dead centre, put a degree wheel on the crank and check the valve timing.
When you have done that, do a cranking compression check on all cylinders.
Remove all four injectors and make sure you can actually see all four are actually spraying some fuel while cranking.
Check the ignition system, including the firing order, plugs and plug leads.
Connect up a timing light and check that the ignition is firing at the correct time.
Whatever the cause, it will turn out to be something really simple (once you find it !)
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Post by wannabe on Oct 31, 2020 10:13:32 GMT
I found that it was really hard to get both cams to be lined up before getting the cambelt on - they were always a fraction out from being absolute centred at the top.
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Post by Zed. on Oct 31, 2020 11:27:24 GMT
I found that it was really hard to get both cams to be lined up before getting the cambelt on - they were always a fraction out from being absolute centred at the top. I use 2 adjustable spanners to position them then clamp the spanners 'handles' togther (where they cross) with a Mole grips  - I'm probably not tho only one to do this and I'm old so have a real UK made 'Mole' grip (made in Newport, Monmouth ) Rich. |
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Post by wannabe on Oct 31, 2020 12:04:27 GMT
I found that it was really hard to get both cams to be lined up before getting the cambelt on - they were always a fraction out from being absolute centred at the top. I use 2 adjustable spanners to position them then clamp the spanners 'handles' togther (where they cross) with a Mole grips - I'm probably not tho only one to do this and I'm old so have a real UK made 'Mole' grip (made in Newport, Monmouth ) Rich. I used one of those locking tools from MX5Parts: www.mx5parts.co.uk/camshaft-locking-tool-mk1-25-p-3348.htmlWas pretty nifty, but does allow a bit of movement in each cam! I didn't have a mole grip and only had one spanner in each size... lol |
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- I'm probably not tho only one to do this 
le sigh