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Post by atlex on Nov 8, 2021 13:15:39 GMT
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Post by atlex on Nov 8, 2021 13:16:29 GMT
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Post by dadbif on Nov 8, 2021 22:06:31 GMT
Mmmm spicy…
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Post by batou on Nov 9, 2021 8:58:10 GMT
Very nice, a proper winter project. Whats your plans for mapping these in where you're currently located?
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Post by atlex on Nov 9, 2021 14:44:57 GMT
Very nice, a proper winter project. Whats your plans for mapping these in where you're currently located? A friend of mine who is an expert tuna will help me get it done right. I might tweak the fueling on the existing ME221 myself until he turns up (or I brave the journey to him.. heh!), though :-) |
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Post by atlex on Nov 13, 2021 12:13:56 GMT
Well, the new cams and bearing surfaces are all lubed up, caps are torqued down to the more-or-less middle of the spec (12nm)
The cams turn without interference but 9mm lift lobes are _really_ close to the limit of the standard cast lips around the tappets/buckets. Pretty much as Toda documented.
There's a smidge over 1mm lash based on my earlier eyeball check with the feeler gauge.
I'm going to get the measurements done this afternoon with stacked feeler gauges and my micrometer which I bought for this specific job.
The new valve springs can definitely be felt when turning the cams, it's a bit snappy, because with the ratchet they fly away from you once the lobe passes maximum lift..
I'm going to end up using a breaker bar to turn them so I can control how they go forward.
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Post by atlex on Nov 13, 2021 21:54:27 GMT
Measurements are in. Good news as all the clearances are nicely over 1.25mm, meaning I can just order OTS shims from a decent supplier, which will be invariably over 1mm in 0.05 increments. So here's the numbers.. - all figures are MM, sorry old boys :-) it's a metric engine  valve, feeler stack that fitted, feeler stack that didn't, and the requested lash clearance per TODA I11,1.466,1.520,0.20 I12,1.477,1.522,0.20 I21,1.347,1.390,0.20 I22,1.394,1.438,0.20 I31,1.392,1.441,0.20 I32,1.448,1.484,0.20 I41,1.455,1.506,0.20 I42,1.455,1.506,0.20 E11,1.516,1.565,0.25 E12,1.516,1.565,0.25 E21,1.365,1.411,0.25 E22,1.521,1.568,0.25 E31,1.480,1.524,0.25 E32,1.516,1.565,0.25 E41,1.511,1.557,0.25 E42,1.581,1.620,0.25 this was based on me getting it so it fitted and then adding the smallest shim finger to the shim stack (0.04mm) at which point I'd get the no-go number. and here's some initial calculations based on these numbers, I've got two different calculations.. go and nogo added together, divided by 2, spec number removed ( gawk '{ FS="," } { GNG=(((($3 + $2) / 2) - $4) )} {print $1" "GNG}' ) #V,G,NG,SPC 0 I11 1.293 I12 1.2995 I21 1.1685 I22 1.216 I31 1.2165 I32 1.266 I41 1.2805 I42 1.2805 E11 1.2905 E12 1.2905 E21 1.138 E22 1.2945 E31 1.252 E32 1.2905 E41 1.284 E42 1.3505 just go with the spec number removed ( gawk '{ FS="," } { G=($2 - $4)} {print $1" "G}' ) #V,G,NG,SPC 0 I11 1.266 I12 1.277 I21 1.147 I22 1.194 I31 1.192 I32 1.248 I41 1.255 I42 1.255 E11 1.266 E12 1.266 E21 1.115 E22 1.271 E31 1.23 E32 1.266 E41 1.261 E42 1.331 I think the 'go-nogo averaged' numbers are the more accurate ones since (to me) the true clearance is somewhere between what fits and what doesn't. My thinking is to order the nearest shims to the averaged ((go+nogo/2)-spec) numbers and then check clearance with the 0.18/0.20/0.23mm fingers once they're in. And in addition to the shims the numbers tell me to get, I'll order a few spares at all sizes in the range, should the real clearance-check-with-shims-in prove I've miscalculated, which I expect will be the case on a few cylinders, but, definitely not all. Any holes in this plot ? LMK |
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Post by atlex on Nov 14, 2021 17:20:37 GMT
Been running more numbers. Like you do. I decided to invert things a bit to see how it looks.
This is how close to the I .20mm or E .25 clearance I'm expecting to get with my chosen shims.
this is based on the $averagedclearance - (shim + spec) AKA a 'variance from spec'
CYL SHIM ($averagedclearance - (shim + spec) "AKA variance from spec")
I11 1.30 -0.007
I12 1.30 -0.0005
I21 1.15 0.0185
I22 1.20 0.016
I31 1.20 0.0165
I32 1.25 0.016
I41 1.30 -0.0195
I42 1.30 -0.0195
E11 1.30 -0.0095
E12 1.30 -0.0095
E21 1.15 -0.012
E22 1.30 -0.0055
E31 1.25 0.002
E32 1.30 -0.0095
E41 1.30 -0.016
E42 1.35 0.0005
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Post by atlex on Nov 15, 2021 11:46:26 GMT
I've put the order in with Cat Cams. Slight tweak to the list of shims for I21/I22/I31/I32 - I'm going up one step for those - in the post above those were on the upper end of the spectrum of calculated eventual clearance. Basically, instead of going for 0.22mm clearance I want instead to go for 0.17mm.
these valves are the original valves, already worn in so I'm not expecting them to tighten much.
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Post by atlex on Nov 15, 2021 13:56:01 GMT
Interestingly the spec from the 4AGE is something like cold 15-25 inlet lash and 20-30 exhaust lash, it's very very similar.
Valve, Spec, Expected Lash with the ordered shim..
I11 0.20 0.193
I12 0.20 0.1995
I21 0.20 0.1685
I22 0.20 0.166
I31 0.20 0.1665
I32 0.20 0.166
I41 0.20 0.1805
I42 0.20 0.1805
E11 0.25 0.2405
E12 0.25 0.2405
E21 0.25 0.238
E22 0.25 0.2445
E31 0.25 0.252
E32 0.25 0.2405
E41 0.25 0.234
E42 0.25 0.2505
So the exhaust side ought to be dead nuts on and the intake is a bit towards the tight side on 2nd and 3rd cylinders (but that's vaguely desirable.)
I think that's enough of number spamming in this thread for a few weeks now, the lash caps will only arrive in december.
I'll be sure to post up the results once I've put the shims in and taken the lash measurements.
Alex
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Post by Zed. on Nov 15, 2021 18:15:34 GMT
So the exhaust side ought to be dead nuts on and the intake is a bit towards the tight side on 2nd and 3rd cylinders (but that's vaguely desirable.) ideally dead centre of tollerance, as to tight - maybe 'lap' the shims with valve-grinding paste on a piece of glass to thin them slightly? I think that's enough of number spamming in this thread for a few weeks now realy?  I'll be sure to post up the results once I've put the shims in and taken the lash measurements. also good for record keeping  Rich. |
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Post by atlex on Nov 15, 2021 21:29:25 GMT
I'm ordering spare shims so if it looks too tight I can try alternatives and/or lap them with some medium sandpaper and oil.
Can't wait to get this engine running again.
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Post by Zed. on Nov 16, 2021 0:04:44 GMT
lap them with some medium sandpaper and oil. place the sandpaper (or wet&dry?) on a piece of glass, glass is (usually?) flat so helps with the sanding. ^^ better with carborundum paste though as it's quicker, still not quick but compared to sandpaper a lot quicker.... Rich. |
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Post by dadbif on Nov 16, 2021 8:13:07 GMT
Never sandpaper, that’s for wood, wet and dry or lapping paste on a sheet of glass. Just like wot Zed sed.
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Post by atlex on Nov 16, 2021 10:46:10 GMT
I'm always confused by sandpaper and wet-and-dry. What I mean is waterproof stuff, with grains close together. I've got some glass lurking about downstairs from a project so we should be good. I understand a figure of 8 pattern with regularly turning the shim 90 degrees should keep the flatness. Ideal date night fidget while watching legally blond or something.
Going to be interesting to see just how on the bullseye the .05mm declared by catcams is. Glad I've got a micrometer which gives another order and a half of accuracy down the scale.
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le sigh
Jul 15, 2023 20:03:52 GMT
le sigh
Jul 15, 2023 20:03:52 GMT